Saw a rig awhile back that had a deutz hooked up to what appeared to be the front end of a pipeliner but may have been a pto type of affair because it had belts running the works.
seemed to work well enough.but never saw the real deal with a diesel,would be a nice combo i would think.
Felon:drinkup:

 

Yes. Yanmar engine, octagon generator, it was put together nice. I don't know how it welded, though.

-Rhyno

 

octagon generator? was thinking a shorthood was before the red face welders. dunno--

 

The ShortHood(s) were before the RedFace(s). Both of them have/had a round generator. The Octagon gens were later and some had the infamous Aluminum.

The one I saw was pieced together to look like a ShortHood with the modern day Charcoal gray paint.

-Rhyno

 

Rhyno, you said SOME octagon generators had aluminum. I thought the reason the generators were octagon was to make room for the aluminum windings. So, some with the octagon generators had copper from the factory? The reason I ask is because I just bought a 1972. CODE 7168, SERIAL # A-691786. It has the terminals just below the faceplate. I bought it thinking it had the aluminum in it. I'll post a pic.

 

Lincweld-
Bare with me as I try to answer. I know that somebody might want to argue and I am not an expert.

I have never heard, that the reason for an octagon style was to create additional internal room for aluminum internals. From what I know, aluminum conducts electricity at a comparable, but less efficient level. The problem with aluminum is that it oxidizes faster than copper. As it oxidizes, it becomes brittle. Eventually, with multiple heat cycles, the aluminum windings beak and can become a temperature activated switch.

Copper flows electrons better and the material is more stable. Hence the copper wound machines have a consistent welding personality. The Aluminum machines seem to be bi-polar.

About 1978- 1983, the "new" manufacturing "wave" was to use aluminum. It was "cheaper to produce, lighter, and could do the same work." Aluminum was used in a number of other wiring projects other than Welding machines. And those industries have learned their lessons, too.

As for the "Shape" of the generator, my guess is that the octagon shaped generators have less man hours in them. Basically they are cheaper to produce, because the pieces don't have to go/pass through more hands and to a lathe to be machined to match the shape. Up until a few years ago, the 300 class machines had octagon generators, with copper internals. The last few that I welded with, had round generators and copper internals.

I can only guess why Lincoln has switched back. It is probably because of the reputation of the "Round style generators" and how people were spending money on them. (Remember that most of the world's decisions are based on money.) I don't know when it happened, but the late 1980's through the current models have copper internals. The last series of 200D's have 400 more windings than the earlier round generators.

Most of the people I know, that have octagon gen sets, have rebuilt them with Fowler (Hybriweld) internals. Fowler has been rebuilding/tuning longer than I have been alive. I heard a rumor that they are the people who produce outdated parts for Lincoln. I have some of their products and I am about to install them. Just looking at them, I can see the craftsmanship. They also have great customer service.

That's probably enough for now.....
-Rhyno

 

here's a picture of the 200 i have. I wasn't too concerned out the aluminum in it. If it is wound with copper, i guess that would be a bonus. I was on stumpf's site looking for faceplates and according to the code 7168, that falls into the redface code range according to stumpf's site. This thing has me all confused now. Here's a picture of it.

 

That is similar to my RedFace. Other than paint, the color of your faceplate, and shape of generator. Your machine looks like a "transition" machine. My guess is that it has a F163, even though your starter is in the same position as mine(F162).

You can contact Lincoln and they will tell you how it was "born."

-Rhyno

 

Thank you Ryhno for your information. I will contact lincoln to get correct info on this machine. Thanks again.

 

Lincweld - Do you already have the Yanmar mill?

Big things are:
Engine's rated KW @ the generator's rated speed. That's around 1500 rpm.
Speed control.
Flywheel coupling.

But the little things can be big hurdles too.

Good Luck

 

Denrep, do you think a yanmar or kubota would be a better swap? I really don't know. The shorthood I have in mind has a load speed of 1400 rpms. I was thinking a slow speed generator coupled with a small diesel engine would be a effiecent performer. I am in the contemplation phase right now. Thanks for the help and information.

 

With a repowerer's eye, I looked at both of those engines in truck refrigeration units and sketched some dimensions. Then I'm sure I saw the same engine, new, disguised as a Cummins, at the Cummins dealer. When I asked at the parts counter about the display engine's heritage, they scoffed at me for suggesting such a thing. That was around the time when DuaneB built his generator plant, but I'm not sure if I got around to posting anything. I'll try to dig up the pics.

Seems like that in reefer form, one engine was shy on power for the SA-200, but the same engine was also available with another rating that was okay.

You really have to study the prospective engine's ratings, because an engine running out of range may overload or "wet" with incomplete combustion. Not good. All modern engines have charts available, which graph an engine's KW rating throughout the rpm range. The charts are probably available online.

Good Luck

 

Sounds like a Fowler Mainliner.... I know they use a Yanmar diesel, and chop older Shield Arc welders. Nice and tidy little package.

http://www.hybriweld.com/shopexd.asp?id=181

 

The Yanmar 4TNE88 or 4TNV88 is what some dealers in TX, LA, & AR have been putting in them for a while now. It is rated to pull a generator load at 1500 to 1800 rpm and has already been proven in welders. Those engines are already proven to pull generators and welders at that rpm so 1400 no problem either. They max at more hp at higher rpm. The Yanmar flywheel has to be remachined to make it work and refit into the frame of course. Yanmar is a popular conversion for marine too now so check with some of the Yanmar marine dealers in your area. Base engine new is about $4500 and with the wiring harness, radiator kit, & Donaldson air cleaner kit about $7000 so could be $8K to $10K plus converting one depending on what else is needed.

SA200 conversion

http://www.americanweldingsupply.com/specials.php

Yanmar engine

http://www.yanmar.com.au/industrial/...ies/4tne88.htm

Yanmar also builds some high frequency portable welders now that use no brushes. I haven't see any being used yet or heard anyone over here talking about them yet what those are like.

http://www.yanmar.co.jp/en/powerprod...s/ytw-300.html

 

You can buy a YanMar through Fowler (Hybriweld.com) thats dressed out with bellhousing plate, flywheel, muffler, motor mounts, and breather for 5500

 

I have welded with, and also across the pipe from, 2 yammar powered Lincoln conversions on xray pipeline. To tell you the truth I wasn't impressed with either one (but that was me and I'm weird so don't trust what I say) :laugh:

One was a shorthood round head conversion (1400rpm), the other an octagon head (probably in the 80's) 1550 conversion.

Work side access is important. Make certain all the "need to get to stuff" is on the right side so you have access when the machine is mounted on your rig. You won't like it if they are not accessible. lol

IMO (again I warn you that I'm old and weird so watch what I say) is a governor meaningful to you? The diesel isn't going to have one....... Can you weld with that head without a governor? IMO - I find with those heads I need a governor, you might not need one. Once you do the conversion you're not going to have one........?

If you haven't welded with your head "without a governor" controlling the RPM's then you need too before you do "any" conversions. (again - OIMO man)

Good luck

 

I ve had this welder for a year now and haven't touched it (much). It burns 2 quarts of oil in a 10 hour day. Last summer i welded a 6 inch line x ray, couple thousand ft. of 2 inch, some hot taps, some ASME pipe DC tigg'n and stick. Last tuesday showed up for some work, hit the starter and "click" "click." fired her up using the crank. Put a water pump on it last october and that's pretty much it. This is my first SA 200, paid $300 for it. This thing pays for itself twice in a day (when i am work'n, which an't much these days). I am tickled pink with this welder. Just thought id throw in an update post, saw this thread was reserected a couple days ago. Thanks to everyone who responds to my threads - ya'll are awsome. have a great weekend!

 

Tom Fowler had his Son-N-Law (Ken) I think his name is putting Yanmar and Kubotas on all of his machines! I seen one of the machines that "Ken" built with a Kubota Diesel and was also chopped 6". That Short Hood was gorgeous! I have also hear that Hybriweld has redesigned the 7 Selectors, I wonder whats the difference?

 

Lincweld
code 7168 is a 1972 , 1972 is a year of transition with 5 different code #'s. Two distinct changes in this code #. First and most noticble is the change to the octagon barrel with aluminium shunt field coils and second is the change to the negative ground altenator.
Rhyno
I agree with your thoughts on the lower cost to manufacture for reasons that some things changed.

a few exerpts from my compiled Code # lists
Start of the "Red Face". The name plate was Red...not black, not blue tint, but Red..
The year was 1963 code # 4999
The "Red Face" ran to 1967, thru code # 6072
Year 1967 code # 6073, the color of the face plate changed back to "Black", same plate just black not red.
This is when the F163 was introduced and the two piece end panel chaned to the singlepiece, dish stamped end panel.
1972 code 7078 was the last year and code # for the round barrel 12V neg ground generator machines
The next code in the run.... 7168

 

from my previous post #20
Then as I have edited it below.

Lincweld
code 7168 is a 1972 , 1972 is a year of transition with 5 different code #'s. Two distinct changes in this code #. First and most noticble is the change to the octagon barrel with aluminium shunt field coils and second is the change to the negative ground altenator.
Rhyno
I agree with your thoughts on the lower cost to manufacture for reasons that some things changed.
A few exerpts from my compiled Code # lists
Start of the "Red Face". The name plate was Red...not black, not blue tint, but Red..
The year was 1963 code # 4999
The "Red Face" ran to 1967, thru code # 6072
Year 1967 code # 6073, the color of the face plate changed back to "Black", same plate just black not red.
This is when the F163 was introduced and the two piece end panel chaned to the singlepiece, dish stamped end panel.
1972 code 7078 was the last year and code # for the round barrel 12V neg ground generator machines
The next code in the run.... 7168

My edited version
" The caviat;
I try to verify this information by cross referencing it from different sources/references. If I cant I will go by what I can. So there may be a gap or an omission. If you have information that is different please share it so we can all get it right. "

So as not to hijack this post, I am posting this info in SA 200 Face plate registry
http://weldingweb.com/showthread.php?t=209831 as well.

Lincweld
code 7168 is a 1972 , 1972 is a year of transition with 5 different code #'s. Two distinct changes in this code #. First and most noticble is the change to the octagon barrel with aluminium shunt field coils and second is the change to the negative ground altenator.

A few exerpts from my compiled Code # lists

Start of the "Red Face". The name plate was Red...not black, not blue tint, but Red..also the top corners of the plate were square.
The year was 1963 code # 4999.
The square top "Red Face" ran to 1967, thru code # 6072

1967 code #6073 starts the Round top Red Face. this was the last code # in 67.

This is when the F163 was introduced and the two piece end panel chaned to the singlepiece, dish stamped end panel.

Year 1969 code # 6791, the color of the face plate changed back to "Black", same plate just black not red.
* Note; I have some information that "suggests" that along with the black plate the red plate was still being used thru 72 but I have no photgraphic proof.
1972 code 7078 was the last year and code # for the round barrel generator machines
The next code in the run.... 7168 , Hex barrel Gen. housing
1973 code 7242 was the last code # for the round top corner Black face machines.

1973 Code 7243 started whats known as the "Green Light" machines

 

Anybody know how to edit a previous post? Or delete it? My last post was well, inaccurate. I should have verified my recollection before posting.

 

This web board has a short and limited amount of time to make corrections.

Definitely, repost the correct info, and ask a MOD to delete the other.

-Rhyno

 

Second last time I was at Continental Engines, they had a 51' I believe - Shorthood that they were putting a Perkins diesel in and has to modify a few things.

I asked the very last time I was there and apparently you can ask for that setup and they'll do is for you - can get it painted or just bare metal
But it's very costly - the word I got from the you g guy there wiring up my redfaces.